In our final week of 2022, I do things a bit differently on the show. Usually, I’m the one preparing questions and conducting the discussions. For today’s show, I sat down with my producers Tristen Bankston and Cameron Tagge and flipped the script. We cover all things Gabby Reece podcast: how it started, how it’s going and where we’ll go with stand out moments, guests, info and much much more. Hopefully this is something you can return to throughout next year to realign, recenter, and let it serve as a guide post for the things you want to do and achieve. Happy Holidays. Enjoy.
Listen to the episode here:
- Behind the Gabby Reece Podcast [00:01:57]
- Looking Back on Podcast Episodes [00:03:05]
- Badass Mentality [00:09:22]
- Reflections on Episodes [00:15:03]
- The Same Five Things [00:20:24]
- Cracking the Reality and Asking the Why [00:26:42]
- The First Episode in 2022 [00:37:47]
- Setting Goals [00:41:08]
- On Mental Clarity [00:50:51]
- On Feedback and Constructive Criticisms [00:58:34]
- Takeaways and Favorite Episodes [01:12:21]
- Aspirations for 2023 [01:17:51]
- On Oils [01:21:07]
- On Sleep and Alcohol [01:29:14]
- On Finances and Investing [01:43:30]
- Thoughts on Health and Wellness Space [01:53:58]
- On Crypto [02:00:51]
- Bursting Our Bubbles [02:04:59]
Reflections on 2022 Podcasts | My Producers Grill Me
Hi, everyone, it’s Gabby. We have it a little different in this episode. I have the brains behind the show, Tristen and Cameron. They’ve been my producers and editors and we’re going to talk about the show, how 2022 went, what we’re hoping for in 2023, my feelings about the podcast, what I’m hoping the podcast either continues to do or keeps morphing into, and getting their feedback and constructive criticisms as we call them.
We’re here to induct you into the science mafia.
I’m ready. I might be a little old though. I’d have to probably pay to get those secrets. They’d be like, “Sex and…”
Do you feel like you don’t have the secrets of the science mafia?
I must have some secrets, keep people around for twenty-something years.
That’s why people keep coming to listen.
That isn’t from baked goods. You better have some secrets and moves.
Do you feel like a scientist or a researcher? Are you curious?
No. I feel like someone who’s not that smart, who’s trying to be well-equipped going into the conversation. Truthfully, it’s the curiosity without too much of an angle or pretending like you have an angle, like, “I’m serious and I am trying to know something.” It’s like, Cool. What are you doing? In order for me to talk to you, let me get as informed as I can.” Simultaneously, try to put that with this idea, “How does that show up in real life?” It’s not just, “Here’s the data and this is what we’re seeing in your metabolic function,” but what does that mean?
It’s the end of 2022 and you had the biggest science mafia guest this year. What is that research like for you? Do you try to tackle one thing they recently talked about? Do you try to dive into everything that they know about? If it’s David Sinclair and any supplement he’s talking about, Huberman, or Tim Ferris, what is that process like for you? It’s like, “They’re coming in next week.”
Sometimes the temptation is to try to know a broad spectrum and you can get in trouble. Tim Ferriss is the one who reminded me. When I spoke with him, it was like, “Ask what you’re interested in.” Sometimes it’s like a vibration in life. I feel like whatever you’re concerned with, I’m probably a little bit concerned with too at that time. It’s not trying to show up in a way, like, “I’m going to show you all the moves and I know all this stuff. I can touch these points and say these words.” Also, maybe what they haven’t been talking about.
A lot of times, when you do the research, you’ll see they’ll be parts of their career that they’re diving into one part and then they’ll start to move into other parts. Maybe it’s to try to also keep moving into the latest parts with a reference back. If that’s important, that other research that they were doing, try to at least touch upon it. If someone’s a new reader or they’ve never even learned about that, then they have a thread if they want to go back and dive deeper.
If you were to try to encapsulate 2022, what does it look like for your show? Top of the year was Andy Galpin.
He’s hard to pin down too because he knows a lot of stuff.
Rick McIntyre, that episode was awesome. I don’t know who he was.
I got weird on that, didn’t I?
It was awesome. I loved it. What makes a podcast special to me at least is I don’t know what to expect. I’m not going in wanting to learn something specific other than the interest of wolves, a wild animal. You’re making connections in not humans’ lives but your life in ways that you can’t prepare for. Obviously, everyone else that’s on the show, scientists and stuff, is amazing because you’re learning things. Also, it’s like a class where you’re trying to tune in and trying to master the craft of a better mind state or working out healthier or, “How can I reduce fear and anxiety?”
My friend was telling me about Rick. She lives part-time in Utah and she saw him speaking and she talked about all these grown men weeping and I was like, “What’s his name?” In all seriousness, it’s not getting so shut into a formula about what makes our life better but noticing the things that do. First of all, Rick himself accidentally dedicated himself to this process. He got called upon and he rose to the occasion, that wasn’t the plan.
He was there for education and then all of a sudden, it’s like, “We’re going to pivot because now I can see these wolves and we’re going to document this.” His consistency in itself as somebody could inspire us in our own life. Also, his sincerity, he almost cried 3 or 4 times on the podcast. We had a terrible connection, we were far apart, and it wasn’t even right here.
He’s up in the mountains right now, right? He’s in a cabin.
Yeah, testing 1, 2. I see him out there cranking to get the electricity. Poor Jenn, we joked that to get the show downloaded, she was like, “Maybe face your computer somewhere else,” because he was in his cabin. It was going to take a while.
He has to go live his life, go to the bathroom, change, and go to sleep.
Jenn’s like, “Turn it away.” For me, as a human being, those people are so rare. I don’t care what they’re doing, studying stones, trees, birds, or whatever. That type of real love for what you’re doing and commitment is inspiring, coupled with the fact that the way we behave in a family dynamic and the way wolves are in a pack are similar. It was easier too once you get going and you realized, “The group that was the most successful wasn’t the most ruthless.” That group petered out, their packs were destroyed or broken up, and their yearlings weren’t as successful.
That always is underlying for everything because it’s a whole picture. People want to narrow it down to like, “Exercise on Monday, Wednesday, Friday, and Saturday. I do it for this many minutes. My heart rate is that. I burned this many calories. I eat this much protein.” Yes, that is all part of it but all that nuance part of it, those relationships, caring for one another and trying to be better.
It’s the expression that the true warrior or badass is you do have a sword, you just choose to not unsheath it.
As I move through my life, I am ultimately not only trying to be successful in the things I’m pursuing whether it’s relationships, work, or whatever. I am truly interested in being a badass but in a real way, not in the, “I exert my will on you and my force,” but that other way where you sharpen your blade. Maybe your blade gets more powerful and you never unsheath it. That interests me because I see it all the time, all the people that I like. I’m like, “I would go to war with them. I would follow them into a fire or whatever it is.” They all have that quality.
[bctt tweet=”What I would say is it can’t be everything all at once, it’s too much. We’re habitual.”]
Do you bring that mentality to the show, you want to master it, be a badass, hone the craft, and have it polished? How do you envision the show?
It’s hard to do. This show is a little bit like parenting for me because I go in each time thinking, “I miss-prepared. You got to trust yourself.” I always feel like I don’t know what I’m doing. When I come out of it, I feel exactly like, “I hope it was good.” It’s hard for me to put that in a box because I’m not willing to try to create such a strict formula because then I won’t let natural things happen. With that comes insecurity and unknowing but that is also part of life and willing to keep doing it and be like, “Hopefully it brings value.”
Of course, you learn as you go but that is one of the reasons to do it because you maybe can’t master it and for people who think that they do, I don’t think it’s true. There’s always something to learn. What you can master is willing to do it the way you do it and not try to copy and that in itself has its own set of disciplines that you have to stay true to. That makes you nervous because you’re like, “What the hell do I know? How do I trust myself if I don’t know if I know what I’m doing?” Those go part and parcel and that’s in everything. If you talk to a lot of athletes, they’re feeling that way quite a bit. That’s the excitement.
Do you see that in the guests that you have on? They’re there to present whatever they’re to present or promote. They’re a master of a craft. Without calling anyone out, do they verbalize, or do you see in them the separation of, “Here’s what I’m presenting but I’m nervous. I don’t quite have all the information.” Are there patterns that you see?
When you do research, the problem is you listen to a lot of interviews. I always find it interesting because I’ve interviewed a lot myself. How do I reframe a thought that is important for this but that I’ve shared before? Either I will say things like, “I’ve said this before,” or I try to say it differently. Sometimes you have guests that have shtick and you’re like, “There it is.” They think that works for them.
I usually find that you have sometimes people maybe that are there to have a real conversation and then also share what they know. Sometimes you have people who have a job they’re trying to get done and they’ve got something to sell, a book, a show, or a product. I try hard to get them off that access and put them in front of me in a way, like, “We’re not going to do that.”
You have people too that want to have church and state. They don’t want to be like, “I’m an expert doctor and I’m going to bring my real personal self here.” You see it. I try to get through it a little bit. I can do that better than most people, especially in person. I interviewed Courteney Cox and I told her PR people, “I’m here for takeaways. I’m not here for gotchas. I don’t care. I am not here to talk about some BS on you. It’s not going to help me.”
Do those external factors affect your show often? Do people’s teams reach out and say, “We need this in it,” or, “You need to cut this.” How do you maneuver all that?
We had somebody who had a personal thing with a parent passing and, for whatever reason, that was hard for them and they didn’t want it in the show. It didn’t enhance the show. For me, I want people to be comfortable. What I find in the long run and more times than not is if you create a safe space, they will tell you more than if you’re trying to get it from them. I know that from my personal experience.
If you seem informed when you’re interviewing me and it doesn’t feel like you’re trying to push me against the wall, I’ll probably tell you a deeper truth. If I see you angling to try to get me to say something or you seem like you don’t know what you’re talking about and you don’t know anything about me, I can see it. Sometimes, with me, it’s like, “How do we safely talk about the stuff that is hard and uncomfortable but in a way that you can manage?” It’s harder.
I’m bringing Courteney up because she’s one of my more well-known guests and the problem is I know her. For me, those are the hardest ones because I want to protect her and them but I know more. Sometimes it’s like, “Let’s go there and I’ll see what you’re willing to say.” With her, she said a lot more than I would’ve thought she was going to say. It’s making sure.
If someone’s uncomfortable, I’ll take it out. You guys know this, we had one person who I felt wasn’t honest. They were selling me so much shtick that I thought it wasn’t fair to the audience because it’s already hard enough as it is. I don’t need someone on here being like, “I don’t suffer that problem.” You don’t suffer from that problem? We all suffer from that problem. We decided not to air that show.
Were there any surprises this 2022 off the top of your head that you can remember?
I’ll be honest, I’ve had a few. Dr. Gundry, originally, does have products to sell. Sometimes when you see him, it’s on the message but the message to support brands, something to sell. I felt him a lot more in this interview. I felt his sincerity. I felt how he pivoted in his practice, learning from a patient. You’ll hear that a lot with these doctors, “I learned from my patients and I had them go in a different direction.” That was a surprise. It’s not a disappointing surprise but I’ve done interviews where I was looking forward to talking to them and they weren’t on their A-game.
Oftentimes, people think maybe I’m a little more dinghy or I come from sports. They don’t realize what I want to talk about. When I see that in the beginning, I’m always like, “I hope that this can burn off,” because that sometimes shows up. Also, the disappointment of, “I didn’t get enough.” Having Tim Ferris, you want to talk to Tim Ferris for two and a half hours and go through it and get all the lists because he is such a wealth of knowledge but you can’t. You always feel like, “I could have done more.”
At a certain point, in the conversation, you relinquish control of the pathway that you might have had set up in your head, which is like life as well.
Here’s the other thing that’s interesting, it’s like going to dinner with somebody and thinking, “This was the conversation I was supposed to have.” this one.” There might be other conversations I hear them have with other people and I’m like, “That was so much better,” or I hear the perfect interview. You hear them being interviewed by somebody and you think, “That’s perfect. I don’t even want to talk to that person.” It’s all part of that. It’s this fine line between the human element and information. How much are we talking about them as a person and getting a different insight on them? Also, coupling that with value to the audience so that they get an idea about, “I could check that out.”
Do you feel like you’ve had a perfect interview? Not that there were no mistakes but this was the one that you’d be like, “I killed this. The guest was there.”
Anything come close?
I don’t think so. I don’t think that’s possible.
What’s your measure for hitting that? What would make you walk away from an interview being like, “That was an amazing interview.”
If I got to that, that means I would be done doing this. You’re supposed to feel, “That was solid.” It’s more about maybe a moment. Maybe there’s a line that somebody says that you think, “That is a perfect line or a perfect answer,” or that’s it. That maybe is more than a whole show. It’s usually them and not me. Some are going to be me because I know me, I’m in my head, and I’m like, “What are you doing? Keep the car on the road.” You don’t ever feel like, “I crushed it.” I don’t think you do. If you do, you’re afraid. You need that weird inner thing. I don’t need that. I’m okay with, “You can keep doing better. Keep working.”
One of our biggest episodes this 2022 was David Sinclair.
Why is that big? It’s big because of the name. It’s not big because of the conversation, I don’t think.
That’s the thing that’s interesting, some of the best conversations, I’m like, “It’s because the person isn’t as known.” David is great. We call it the science mafia, him and Huberman. I don’t know if the sleep doctor is going to make it. Galpin got brought in, did you see that? They did an eight-part series or something, him and Huberman together.
How about Kyle Gillette?
I like him but we’ll see. It’s all about the development thing, you got to develop how you communicate. It’s all of that. It’s harder than people think.
Do you think there’s an agent behind this? Is there one? Is there a group of agents behind this?
It’s Huberman and Rob Moore. They’re Gs. They’re freaking smart. If they can do it and do it for Huberman, they’re going to do it better for these guys that are trying to give you hard, mind-bending deep, and heavy content. Who’s doing it better? Nobody. They’re so smart. I like it. It’s great.
David Sinclair talked about taking resveratrol, metformin, NMN, and quercetin. Do you currently or do you ever take any of these? Did you stop? Did you start?
I never got into the metformin because you need a prescription. I’m not diabetic. Is that lazy? It might be lazy. I take NMN, I have it here, and it tastes like concrete and yogurt. It’s amazing. Quercetin, everyone should take. That was reconfirmed by Perlmutter as well. They say 500 but it’s 1,000.
Any age and any health.
Yes, because it’s uric acid and there are a lot of positive things, chronic inflammation, or certain things. This is the thing, all of these doctors and scientists, everybody is saying the same five things from different points of expertise. Whether it’s Chris Palmer talking about your mental health, the GI specialist, if it’s Chutkan talking about your microbiome, or it’s Sinclair, whatever it is talking about aging, it is the metabolic function, it’s chronic inflammation, it’s a handful of things that keep expressing themselves and messing up our systems in a myriad of ways.
Whether it is hypertension or high cholesterol, which is BS anyway. For the most part, if it’s cancer or depression. A lot of the stem problems, the root problems, are pretty much the same five things, which is super exciting. It’s also interesting to me how many shows are we going to do to figure out how to talk about those same five things. It’s until people are ready to hear about it. You might be at a place in your life where you’re either too young or overwhelmed with something else that you can’t hear and then one day, you’re like, “I heard that.”
For me, I’m like, “No problem.” We’ll keep tap dancing around those same five things and it’s like, “It sounds like this and it sounds like that,” but it’s the same thing. I like that because they’re pretty consistent. All of these people are saying the same things over and over so I like that because it makes me feel like also it’s an opportunity to do a good job. Otherwise, you’re another person who’s a part of the confusion and I don’t want to do that. It doesn’t mean everyone has to agree with everything. if you have Dr. Gabrielle Lyon or Stacy Sims and they’re talking about maybe not fasting for women or a lot of protein, there’s always going to be someone upset about that, which is funny.
It takes some form of clever repetition because the first time you hear about it, it’s a lot of information. You hear the word quercetin and then you internalize that, you hear it, and you talk about it again. You finally say, “Let me look this up. Let me see what this does.” It takes a full knowing in your body to know what it does, how to take it, and what to do.
Also, your why. This is important. I’m not interested in people doing what I’m asking or what people are on the show asking. I’m interested in having a sense of it for themselves and being like, “This is why I’m going to take it.” Otherwise, they won’t do it from one week to the next. It’s like with my kids, I have a daughter and it’s appalling what she’s eating as she should. The other two are out of that, graduated from that, and they eat healthily because they understand why they want to and how it makes them feel. I’m not going to be in your pocket. You got to get your own reasons why.
In this show, that’s why I always say I try to make things an invitation. We have a joke in the pool training. I’ll have athletes in front of me and I’ll say, “Here’s the drill.” I invite or challenge you, whatever your mechanism is because that’s how people are. Some people are like, “I can’t do it. I’ll show you.” For other people, you’re like, “You’re telling me? I don’t want to do it.” It’s this weird balance of, “I’m going to invite you but also, we’re going to be accountable for the information.” If it keeps showing up as solid, at some point, you can argue at all you want and it’s still an invitation but it is what it is. That’s how I approach it.
By the way, I can figure it out, some of it, on my own. If people don’t agree or whatever, I’m fine with that. The hope is that the discovery is, “That’s starting to make sense to me. I’ll try it.” None of it happens overnight, that’s the problem. With the exception of getting rid of some really bad relationship, apologizing, or making amends with everybody, most of the stuff we’re talking about is the accumulation and the overtime stuff. That is a hard thing to sell because it’s not instantaneous. That’s why people have to have their own buy-in.
We all have our own personal whys but I feel like there are certain people in my life including some family members who aren’t even to that. I feel like there’s a step before the why, the reality has to be broken. You have to see the red pill and the blue pill. I’ve always been trying to talk to my parents about it andfood and exercise is the big one. I’m curious if you have any advice on how to help crack that reality so then they can discover their own why. I feel like there is a step before the why. Once you get the why, then you’re in for the long run, and you’ll make the commitment.
It’s that reality of not even understanding it or growing up a certain way, which was me. Moving to LA, being in the industry, acting, and all these things, that’s what cracked me. I was like, “There’s health stuff. I’m going to do it for this.” I now see the long-term benefits of this. This makes total sense. For people like my parents, my siblings, or people who are close to me that don’t see that, encouraging someone or helping crack that reality, how would you approach that? Is it even possible?
For some people, it may not be. Of course, with everyone, everything’s always possible. What I would say is it can’t be everything all at once, it’s too much. We’re habitual. I’m habitual. Humans are habitual. It’s one small change first. If someone’s drinking soda, for example, that is a good one to take out and get a pretty big benefit of the amount of sugar and some of the stuff that’s in it and break it down. Be like, “Is there a substitute?”
The other thing is a small change, give it a substitute. If somebody, for example, sits on the couch right after dinner, go say, “Could you start to, three times a week, take a fifteen-minute walk after dinner even if it’s cold outside?” There’s even science showing the benefits of walking after you eat, a lot. Say, “Is there one food that isn’t probably serving you?” Ask them and see if they can locate it because they probably can.
If they can, say, “Are you willing to either remove that or can we figure out a way where 5 or 6 days a week, you’re on point when you go hang out with the boys, you’re doing the family barbecue, go crazy, or ordering pizza night, that’s not going to kill you, hammer you.” Have a strategy. You can’t just say, “You shouldn’t eat that.” “What does that mean? I shouldn’t eat that. What should I eat instead? All of that or which that?”
Slowly add little lifestyle bells and whistles, whether it’s these walks. Could they go to a certain class two times a week? Make these slow changes. Also, it has to be because they want. If you’re just putting it in on someone and they haven’t asked for that, it’s like if you’re walking down the street and someone’s like, “You need directions?” It’s like, “No, I’m good.” It’s annoying.
Believe me, I have family members. I was raised by a couple that has suffered with the lifestyle the whole time. I don’t say much. They think I disapprove of everything and they realize I don’t live like that. It’s saying, “I’ve been learning. I’ve been trying this. Maybe you could try this.” Also, if it feels like there’s a desire. If there isn’t, they’re probably going to have to go to the doctor and get a bill of health that is not great.
[bctt tweet=”Control what you can.”]
You have to have a scary check.
They then go, “Maybe I should…” That is an unfortunate part of it. If someone’s like, “I’m ready.” You can do it slowly. The food is the ass-kicker. Let’s say people have the weight that they want to lose but even if they start to get the food right, if their body is still in that inflamed state, it’s still pretty hard to lose the weight. It feels overwhelming, like, “I’m eating salads and this and that but I’m nothing’s changing.” That’s the hard part. It’s understanding, “I got to get the sugar out. I got to get the seed oils out. I have to get these things out that is causing this chronic inflammation.” It’ll be hard otherwise.
The other conversation is it’s set up not for us to be successful, this is something to navigate so it’s not easy. Saying to them, “This isn’t easy.” The fact that we have to work to be healthy, it’s this weird pocket of, “I give myself grace and I have to be honest with myself simultaneously all the time.” What do you want? How much do you want it that you go, “I’m not going to make excuses. I’m not going to complain that the store is a nightmare. I’m going to then figure it out.”
Sometimes it’s frustrating to be on the other end of it, wanting it for them. You make a great point of leading by example and then spoon-feeding it. My own personal experience is small changes for sure help but I find that when I wake up, make one bad decision, and then I’ll make another bad decision, or if I make one good decision, I’ll make another good decision. It’s like, “Today will be a healthy day.” We started with a workout, doing an interview, and I’m going to keep that going. I’ve mapped out how it works for me but I don’t know how it works for other people. For example, my mom, I’ve been saying the same thing, “Go on a walk and cut out the sugar. You’re eating pop tarts for breakfast, don’t do that. Try eggs.”
Do people still eat pop tarts? Those are good. Those things are amazing. What about this conversation? “I love you. Since I moved away, I’ve learned a lot.” If someone’s not complaining, that’s the other part. If the loved one is like, “I don’t feel good. I want to lose 20 or 30 pounds,” or whatever the pounds are, then it’s the time. It’s hard. This is life and that’s love.
I’ll tell you a quick story. I had a coach. Maybe you’ve heard this story before. I was in college at Florida State and we weren’t playing well, we weren’t performing well, but on top of it, our attitude sucked. It’s one thing to not perform but you’re still trying and it’s whatever. It’s even another thing to be performing while your attitude sucks. Both, at the same time. She calls a timeout and we all get in the timeout. The team is there, twelve of us, and she’s there.
Usually, it’s like, “Do this. Do that.” She doesn’t say one word. We put our hands in to break and to go back to play and right before we went, she goes, “I don’t know what to tell you because I can’t want to win more than you.” We weren’t even in a position to get information about what to do because we weren’t ready. Why tell us? When you’re ready, I’m here to help you. That’s how it is.
That probably translates to parenting as well I imagine. You’re extending the olive branch unconditionally and you have to be there patient whenever it can be ready but not act like you know it all as well. You can’t know it all.
You don’t know it all for them, that’s the other thing though. You’re not in their head. They take the olive branch and whip you with that olive branch, I’m kidding. That’s more like parenting. Leading by example and listening are what seem to always show up for me in parenting. Lead by example and listen. When the kids are much smaller, you have to have some healthy boundaries. It still doesn’t help, I’m joking.
I believe that when you believe that they’ll find their way, they feel that from you. Parenting is no joke. I’ve had one situation that we went through over six years ago. After I got this information about some stuff that was going on and what one of my kids was feeling, I walked upstairs into my bathroom, put my face two inches from my mirror in my bathroom, looked into my left eyeball, only the eyeball, and was like, “You got to keep your crap together. You can’t fall apart.”
You’re just right there.
I was like, “This is the thing that could launch you.” Also, even launch the marriage. We’d go to our corners and lick our wounds and be like, “Can I blame somebody for this?” It’s great. It is the real thing.
I got cats. I know the feeling.
It’s the same. The thing is I wish I had cats. Your kids are like cats because you’re like, “You’re good over there? Great.”
They take care of themselves.
They come rub on your leg and you’re like, “Perfect. Great.”
Is there anything in the podcast from the start of it that you’ve taken away specifically with parenting for many of the guests? A lot of the times, it’s you talking about parenting and telling your stories and your trials and going through it. Is there anything that’s taken an effect on you or a major takeaway?
Before I started this show, I had gone through enough serious things in parenting that I had to get help. You hear me talk a lot about Byron Katie. I just saw her, we went to visit her socially, and she was saying she told her husband that she had this dream or something that the end of the world was happening. Stephen Mitchell is her husband and he’s like, “What did you do?” She’s like, “I had to watch it to have the opportunity, to be a part of this, and to see it.”
She looks at everything differently. It’s a total crap show and she’s like, “Isn’t it amazing?” I’m like, “I don’t know. My face is on the ground and my kid’s shoe is on my head.” I would say that a lot of the people I talk to, I had to get help sooner than that, and it’s an ongoing thing because every kid is different. If you said to me who has helped me the most, it certainly has been Katie and what that has been is offloading the expectation. She says God is reality and she’s in love with reality, that’s what she says. The minute you use should or could, you’re out of reality even as a parent. That is a hard, sobering, and liberating lesson.
That’s tough to accept, for sure.
Your first episode of The Gabby Reece Show was with Laird in January 2020 talking about parenting.
Did we talk about it? We probably cried. Were we crying?
You were playful.
If you don’t have your humor in this thing, you are done. We were playful because we were trying to survive it.
Does it still feel that way?
That we’re playful? Yeah.
Two years, post-COVID, and kids are older.
We only get more playful thanks to Laird. Laird is mischievous enough in the best way and he has a wisdom that you can’t get from a book. He has the wisdom from being in nature and the lessons of nature and the ocean that make him weirdly wise. He’s funny. I appreciate that Laird is genuinely himself, good and bad. It helps me because I can get rigid. I have a drier wit and Laird helps me live in that more, for sure.
If you don’t see the humor, you are dead. You’re going to get it. Whether it’s from work, try being an entrepreneur. We went public and had our stocks get crushed during COVID. It was like, “Yay,” boom. You’re sore, you’re an athlete, you’re beat up, you’re injured, and you have kids that are testing you. They’re your kids so in every way that you’re not prepared to handle it or it’s your traits, there it is. Laird is a good partner to go through stuff with and he is a lot of fun and he’s intense. It’s not like it’s all a walk in the park but I’ve learned. I know the language, It’s been a long time.
What might have impacted me in the first few years of our marriage, I’m like, “There it is.” It’s important. When you’re in any situation and especially in a romantic situation, it’s remembering that the quality that usually we love is a direct line to something that is hard about the person or what we would say is hard if we choose to look at it that way. Sometimes one side has to exist so the other can.
For example, I’m organized, and I get a lot done, but I’m in my head a lot, and I’m far away. Laird is super present, passionate, and intense. It’s stomp, stomp, grumble, and grumble, not a politician, and not here to make you feel comfortable. That tension has to live, it’s the way life is. If you think it’s other, it’s like being a child, you’re being a child.
Speaking of the first episode and creation of the podcast, I was curious if you had any original goals that you set out to accomplish when you first made the podcast and if you’ve hit those goals. If not, a follow-up question would be, what’s your process now that we’re at the end of 2022 to approaching goal setting and goals?
I did that podcast before with Neil Strauss, which is how I met the two of you. I was getting my feet wet. When I used to do a lot of interviews for television, that was a different way of interviewing people. I thought, “I’ll learn a new skill and I’ll do it with Neil.” I maybe leaned on Neil. Also, he likes that because he wants to be in control so it worked out. I have this weird thing of not always thinking I can do this well.
Is it like imposter syndrome, kind of?
Yeah. It’s funny because I’ve been interviewing people for a long time and then everyone has a podcast so I’m like, “Maybe I’m going to have a podcast.” I do think maybe within it, I do have a skill for it. Laird is like, “Okay, Gab.” Sometimes people say at the end of the show, “You’re good at this.” I’m like, “Yeah, thanks.” It’s this weird thing.
I did it with Neil to lean on it and develop this new skill. When I started this, I don’t even think I was at a place to be good enough to set goals except to do a good job and to bring value if people were going to hang out with me. If you spent time, there would be something that enhanced your life in some way, whatever that was, whatever person needed or could take away at that time, that was the goal. If I could be honest, I don’t know if I’ve done that.
There’s no gauge for that.
People could say, “What do you think you mean or represent?” I go, “Only people can tell you. I can’t tell you.” Secretly, deep inside, it is a male-dominated space, especially in the area I live in. I’m not talking about martinis, nails, and plastic surgery for every show. It’s not like a kibitz show. Inside of me, I want to take ownership of this space as a female in this male world. It’s not because I’m like, “I want to get in here as a girl.” I don’t even think that way. It’s to be representing another perspective. It doesn’t mean only the female perspective but it means the perspective of somebody, like, “If I have to work but I have kids and I’m a mom.”
Joe Rogan has three daughters. His perspective is going to be different than mine. I want to keep bringing that because what I have to navigate and orchestrate, other people do too but that’s without alienating the men. The content is rich enough, real enough, and tangible enough that they go, “Cool. I can handle a couple of mom comments because there’s so much stuff to put in my pocket.” I’m not even close to that. That’s what I would like to do. I don’t want to overdo it with the female but I know there are not a lot of women doing it. We bring a different perspective.
I can speak from my own experience of any time you’ve talked about stuff in that realm including parenting and kids, I’ve always found it interesting, and there’s something to take away from it whether it’s like, “I plan to have kids and want to remember this.” You accomplished both perspectives in digestible ways that have an effect. At least I can only speak for myself. It’s up to how our audience thinks about it. From my perspective of starting the show and listening to older episodes, there’s something to gain from both of those perspectives.
What people don’t realize is, in a way, I’m more masculine than all three of you.
I was going to say that.
He kicks my ass when I work out.
Not in that obvious thing. I have a male emotionality. My husband who is so masculine is the more emotional. When it comes to it, if the fire’s coming or something needs to be done, Laird is at the sharp end of the stick. Day-to-day, I have a male way of doing things. I’m studying it and researching it. I’m like, “I’m experiencing this as a mother and I’m also learning simultaneously and observing it.” I observe things a lot and analyze them. When I say that, that’s also it too. By the way, I understand men on some level.
At what point did you become aware of that by yourself?
College athletics, I was around a lot of guys and you start to realize, “I understand what they’re doing.” If I had girlfriends, they’re like, “Why?” You don’t know what’s behind that. You don’t know what’s going on there. I learned that. There are some things I appreciate and some of you would be like, “Those are the things that I’m going to move away from,” as a female in that male dynamic.
Other things, I’m going to understand it like a big sister or a friend that is a female. Also, call men on it. That’s the thing, if you’re going to be friends, you have to be honest and be like, “You know that you’re doing that, right? You’re not doing that with her or whatever.” It’s that. I don’t have anything attached to it. I have a masculine point of view, which worked well.
At times, it’s hard because when you’re a parent or a mom, I see other moms and I’m like, “You suck,” meaning me. They’re like, “We’re decorating Christmas cookies.” I’m like, “Oof.” There’s always that. It’s all of it. It’s owning all of it and being like, “I wish I was sweeter in that way.” I am a true caregiver but it’s a matter of fact, like, “Here’s your stuff and it’s done and it’s good.” It’s not like, “Sweetie…” Sometimes I wish I had more of that. I have a friend, Tiffany, and she’ll be like, “You kids stop that. Get up to your room or you’re going to get in trouble.” I can say, “Would you like a cupcake?” It sounds meaner than her. It’s one of the things.
What that goes back to is encouraging people. We’re all doing the best we can and you’re going to do it the way you do it and that’s okay too as long as you keep working on stuff. To answer your question in an incredibly long way, I would like to take more real estate in a space that I know is dominated by men. It’s not because it’s dominated by men but to add another perspective.
The follow-up to that with that being your goal, which I love, is, what’s your process for setting goals? Do you do that? Do you do a yearly review? Do you do the New Year’s goals and resolutions thing? Do you have a different take on it?
I do because I’m always so goal-oriented, it’s obnoxious. I do six months, a year, 3, 5. Also, what happens is I am verbalizing it now. I didn’t realize I fully do it but I have an internal prayer and visualization practice that’s on a lot, it’s constant. It’s like, “What do you want? Where are you going? How are you going to do that?” It’s a lot. That gets incorporated daily into the drive of, “Where am I going and what am I doing?” The only thing that gets in the way of that, quite frankly, is my life and the demands of the things that ultimately are still more important, which are my family and relationships. They get in the way a lot.
That resonates, for sure. Do you schedule a time to allow yourself to do that or is it always happening?
When you go out, when you go to the store, when you’re in the car, when you’re in a shoot, when you’re doing a show, and when you’re parenting, have you found ways to keep mental clarity and health and give yourself to the moment? That happens with me, creatively running all the time, and then life gets in the way where someone asks something of me or I need to go do something else that isn’t in line with what I was daydreaming about or make a sacrifice here or make dinner there or go see this person. I’ve hit points where I don’t give my full self to that situation because I was trapped in this over here. It can create bad encounters with my significant other, with friends, and with family. It’s not like screaming matches but not fully present. I don’t know if you’ve run into that or if you’ve found ways.
It happens all the time. You get better at separating and almost keeping it private. I can pick up someone from school and still be doing that. The other thing I will say though because I’m a lot older than you is, at the of the day, none of it’s going to matter if my real life and my real relationships aren’t great or I’m not great for the people around me. Maybe I know that to be true.
It’s like if you were standing there, you’re thinking, and you’re in the shore break and a wave comes and it’s better to lie down, go with it. Sometimes when these things come that interfere with this thought, this goal, this mindset, or what have you, instead of fighting or continuing what you were doing, it’s better to go with it.
If a kid wants to talk to you or if a partner wants to connect, it’s like, “I have a deadline. I have to go into my office and record something and get it done.” You start to learn because you will never be sad. You will never regret that. You could accomplish the whole world and it won’t matter. This I know, that is one of my North stars.
What you do is you make these incremental improvements in this creative pursuit or professional pursuit or whatever way that you’re trying to express yourself in this way, this dream. Your real life is layering and it’s happening and that’s all made up of the quiet things, it’s never the big monumental things. You got to do those because you can’t phone those in. Those don’t happen on their own. You’ll get there somehow.
[bctt tweet=”I feel like there’s a step before the why, the reality has to be broken.”]
For the people who aim and shoot and they’ve got it all written down and they have their practice, see how that’s working out. Maybe that’s the end question. We don’t know what it’s all about. It’s like, “What’s it all about? What are we doing here?” I don’t think it’s just to accomplish. As much as I’m driven and goal-oriented, I’ve lived like that pretty much my whole adult life and it seems to work out. To be honest, I’ve talked about this in my solo podcast, I don’t even know how I got anything done or if I was good at anything or successful in any way but it works.
To answer that, it’s parallel pathing. If you’re that driven and you want to be that successful, you will be. Do you want to pay that price? I don’t. I want to have a real life. I want to have a shot at having a real life. I want to participate in real life with the people with that I’m close and see what that also looks like. How far can I take those relationships? How can I grow in my marriage, my friendships, and my daughters? That’s still first, even though sometimes I’m mad that it’s first if that makes sense. No matter what, you wouldn’t feel good any other way. That’s the interesting part.
Has that always been your pursuit or was there something that changed or a certain moment in your life that changed, going after all this stuff, trying to be successful, and trying to accomplish so much? That’s where I feel like we’re at right now where we’re dead set on, “How much can we accomplish? What can we create? Who can we collaborate with?” I’m curious about what changed for you or when it changed.
Usually, when they hand you a child, that kicks you into it. I want to say that, by the way, in my early 20s, I was focused. There’s a time for that too. I don’t want to act like, “I’ve all had this balance the whole time.” I was in airplanes four days a week. I was doing a million things at one time. I got a lot of that over with from 18 to 27. I packed a lot of that in and then it was like, “I’m now in a relationship. Support that person and some of their goals.”
In my early 30s, here’s a child. It naturally happens. I want to encourage people, the beautiful thing is if you’re single or it’s you and another person, grind out day to night, go for it, for sure but keep looking up once in a while. You have to build a life, it doesn’t smack you in the head. You have to also build it and participate in it. Sometimes it’s not that sexy stuff, it’s that quiet stuff. You said your dad would take off time to come to events. Was that it? What were we talking about that?
Yeah. There’s something you said.
My dad is a surgeon but he would coach our sports growing up.
That impacted you.
Yeah, for sure.
It wasn’t like people were like, “Amazing coaching job.” It’s that quiet stuff.
It’s tough. I know he was trying his best. I love both my parents, they’re both amazing people. The coaching was probably a step too far for wanting to be involved in our lives because he’s a high achiever. He was in the Olympics world camp in 1980, a surgeon.
What you’re saying is that’s a bad example. You’re like, “Gabby, do you have a tissue? I want to talk about that.”
I have two older brothers and they’re a year apart. I’m 4 and 5 years younger than them. There are weird dynamics between three boys. To be involved in our lives, he went all in and had all the books and all the DVDs. He coached every single sport for all of us, for everyone. It hit a point where it probably didn’t create a healthy relationship growing up.
I meant a little of that maybe. It’s like, “Go to the game.”
“Just show up.”
He has always been that support force for whatever I’ve been chasing in my life outside of that, film, music, or anything.
His support is crazy.
That’s good and it’s different than what he does.
He’s funny. He’s a surgeon. He saves babies’ lives every day. When I was pursuing acting, he was like, “You have the ability to change people’s lives.” I’m like, “Daddy, you save people’s lives.” He’s like, “Yeah but I can only impact one or a small group of people’s lives at a time. With the ability to create and express art, you can impact millions.” He fully believes it. You tell that to other people chasing acting.
His life is that way because that’s how he looks at life and that’s what’s beautiful. He maybe sees the opportunity to do that in everything and other people may never see it in anything. It shows you why your dad’s doing what he’s doing. What do you guys want me to do differently in this show? I’m not precious.
More sound effects. More air horns.
I’ve got a small thing.
I bet Neil Strauss never asked you this question.
Neil Strauss would ask, “What’s the solution? I don’t want problem-based thinking, I want solution-based thinking.” This is a small thing but it could benefit the guests when you’re asking a question. A lot of times, you like to give a lot of context to a question, which is great. You’ll start a question and then go on to a story or something that relates to that question. I would like to challenge you to straight up ask the question and give the context or give the context and straight up ask the question. There’s a tendency I’m noticing because I’ve edited tons of these now so I’m starting to notice the patterns and stuff.
Is he crying, Justin? “I’ve listened to hundreds of these now.”
I love it.
You’re in a safe space. I don’t know if it’s safe, you can’t get out.
I got it.
That was a small thing.
It’s great. Why not? That’s why we’re here.
It’s a small thing that I would like to challenge you to see a way you ask certain questions. I also will say that if you get your head about it, forget what I’m saying if you’re starting to think about how you’re asking a question or your interview style.
It’s good. Anything else? What else?
It stems that you’re a thinker. You see a full picture of things. If you’re asking a direct question, sometimes your brain takes you to context and then back to the question but the question is different than how you started the question. The guest might not know what the answer is. In the long run, are we seeking answers? No. The challenge is to ask the question, let them answer, and then the context comes through the conversation. It’s a dance, it’s not like it has to be a certain way.
I want to know. Justin, you can chime in too. Go ahead.
I’m excited about the potential of doing live shows.
I better get that direct question.
Also, possibly bringing in the listener’s questions.
That would be easier. It’s easier for me to answer questions than it is for me to try to tell the story every time with a guest. It’s so much easier.
Here’s another thing.
We’ve opened the door.
No one’s doing anything wrong.
“It’s not you, Gabby, but..”
“The guy pushing the button keeps screwing up.”
I’m not going to be traumatized. Go for it.
As comfortable as you can get with it but embracing the unfiltered conversation that you have with us on the phone into some dynamic interviews. It’s case by case but if we asked you your take on the mindfulness industry or health and wellness, how you would talk to us on the phone is incredible. It’s funny, it’s engaging, it’s a little bit spicy, and it’s a little bit of a hot take but it has specific examples. It’s like, “Get things done.” It’s tough love, like, “I’ll pat you on the back but I’m not here to BS you.”
Do you think I’m too nice?
No, I don’t think you’re too nice. It’s something to embody, feel what it feels like, and then take that into conversations and interviews.
You don’t think that’s scary?
They call her Gabe. My friend, Nancy, is like, “Gabe’s here.”
I don’t want that to be the focus.
We can only shoot from our experience. Every time we’ve had a conversation with you not on a mic or not an interview where you’re giving us some advice or we’re talking about the podcast, you’re straight up in a way that resonates hard with us that we always walk away from our conversations being like, “The energy she had and the way she’s giving us the information is super straight up and no BS.” It resonates with us, for sure.
How does that show up in the show?
A good place to start is the bonus episodes and the content that you have control over instead of when you have a guest here and you got to honor the guest and you don’t want to be thinking about how you can voice your hot take opinion. It’s starting with the bonus episodes and more conversations between us about it and the things that you say that affect us. You said that the male perspective is super important and that’s one quality that you uniquely have that when you do get on a ramp, sometimes the way you say things affects us in a positive way. We walk away being like, “She’s so right. I need to get my crap together.”
It’s always like a hedge. I’m trying to not be so harsh because my real self all the way is, to the point, indirect. I have to figure out how to bring that in a way that’s still obviously a reflection of me but not off-putting because that can be a bit off-putting. If you don’t know me and you’re not in a relationship with me and know that I come from a pretty good place, you might be like, “Whoa.”
You got to gauge your guests too. With us, no filter, and no nothing, we want to hear all of it. With certain guests, you got to feel their energy and see where it leads you.
It’s adding a dash of it like a recipe.
Does it ever show up in the podcast? Do you ever hear it come out or is it tempered the whole time?
It gets there.
I would say more often than not, it’s understandably tempered.
Do you ever hear one line where you’re like, “There she is.”
Yeah, for sure.
I should probably stop doing edibles before I get the podcast. I’m joking, I don’t.
Do a shot of tequila, that would bring Gabe out. That’s noted. What else?
That’s a hard note to get. It’s not a note, it’s more of an observation of our conversations. It’s something to note that it resonated with us. Sometimes when you’re straight up, we love it.
The awareness, we’ll start to include it. Doing it on Zoom with someone whose connection is bad and then doing it with someone who’s a standup comedian and you’re in the same room and they’re smoking and drinking is two different experiences.
Also, I’m going to tell you something whether you realize it or not because I’m not a female comedian. A lot of times, people don’t want to hear things a certain way from a woman, they just don’t. It’s too harsh. It’s an interesting dance because when you’re in a female community, you can say, “They’re the ones. They’re off the hook. They’re allowed.” With everyone else, it’s like, “Whoa.” People would say, “That doesn’t seem fair.” I don’t even talk about fairness, you’d know what is. Sometimes if I glide there versus cut there, I can get to the point but I hear what you’re saying.
That’s a great point though.
Do you know what I mean?
Absolutely. That’s not a perspective that we could say we relate with. We’re not women.
No, you can’t because you’re dudes.
We don’t experience that.
Guys go, “Da, da, da.” They go, “Yeah.” For girls, you go, “Whoa.” It’s true.
If you, with your energy, explain that, that makes me perk up and listen and go, “Yes.” If I didn’t know that, I know it now and I’m excited to listen to it. There’s a facade to it that some people have when they talk about it that makes me go, “Ehh.”
It’s true. I’m sensitive sometimes.
Even you getting meta, even you explaining that to us right now, like, “Some people don’t want to hear certain things come out of your mouth because you’re a woman.” It’s a dance for you. It makes me interested and go, “Let me hear what she has to say.”
“Let’s push those buttons.”
“Let me see what conversation is this without naming people or doing anything.”
For me, it’s the end goal. I never go look at it and go, “That doesn’t seem fair and it shouldn’t be like that.” I’m past that. I’m interested in, like, “What am I trying to accomplish? What hat do I have to put on to do that?” Versus, “I’m going to buck the system.” I feel like bucking the system is when you can be in there and have a voice in there and represent something but it is a dance.
You’re not going, “Woe is me.” You’re also not going, “It’s okay.”
I’m not saying that. It’s a maze that you’re cutting through. What turns are you making?
That’s something that can resonate with men and women.
It’s biological. Everyone wants everything to be leveled off, fair, and all this stuff. There’s some biology crap that’s floating out in the world. Don’t ask me why. It is that way. The thing is I experience it. I can hear something sometimes from a certain person, female or male. Sometimes it comes across as harsh from a female unless she’s a mother lifting a car that’s on fire and then it’s like, “Everyone, screw off.” It’s an interesting delivery system. It’s trying to figure it out and already being naturally pretty direct. It’s not like people go, “Gabby is so sweet,” and then they know how to take it. It’s weird.
What you said though is spice. You follow your instinct and you do you.
I appreciate that.
It is something that has resonated with us.
Believe me, I sit here with the gatekeeper all day long.
What have other people told you about this show? At some point this year, Whitney Cummings or someone said they loved the bonus episodes because it felt natural.
I don’t know if that’s a real reflection of who. People will say that they like that free-floating because it’s just conversational. What I do is I write down a few points that I know I’m going to try to visit and then I just go. I don’t have anything set. I don’t stop, I don’t pause, and I don’t do anything, I just go because I’m trying to be honest, and that’s the only way. In a way, if I had a framework for things to talk about, those are pretty easy for me. You then always think, “Who going to listen to this?” What is there? There’s no back and forth. It’s trying to give a real intimate perspective.
There’s no back-and-forth with Huberman.
He’s gunfire, load, and data. His preparation must be insane.
There’s a place for that, not facts but feeling.
That’s what resonates with me the most. For example, one of the questions we wanted to ask, all four of us, was an episode or a guest that was our biggest takeaway or a favorite episode. For me, it was Simon Hill. What did it for me was that not all of the facts of why we should be eating plants and changing these things, it was his story about his dad having a heart attack that resonated with me more than any of the dense information would ever resonate with me.
That was my biggest episode for 2022 because that was such a relatable story. I’ve gone through similar things with my parents, not a heart attack but cancer and things like that. That’ll make you wake up. I related to it so much. Now, everything I think about with food is like, “I need to eat more plants.” Plants are the answer. Plants and no Advil, that’s my two biggest takeaways.
The big one is about headaches.
That’s this guy.
We talked about how if you played basketball, you’re sore.
it’s probably me.
I feel like it was Cameron. Was it you where you’re like, “I have a headache.” I was like, “Why do you have a headache?”
[bctt tweet=”If you’re that driven and you want to be that successful, you will be. Do you want to pay that price? I don’t. I want to have a real life.”]
It was me. We were like, “We’ll get to the root cause.”
He’s like, “I have a headache.” I’m like, “Isn’t the bigger question, why do you have a headache?”
“Why are you dehydrated?”
What did you do?
I was prescribed Ambien when I was in high school.
I’m trying peppermint oil now for headaches.
Lavender as well. It’s like a hormone headache. Laird is the one, he puts the lavender a lot on my temples and then you put it on your feet. It does help. It weirdly helps.
I’ll do the lavender too but peppermint is a game changer for me.
What else do you guys want me to do?
I have two things. One is I said my episode, guest, and big takeaway. I want to hear everybody. Either a huge takeaway, a favorite episode, or a highlight. It doesn’t have to be a crazy thing or something that you learned that you do.
Rick Rubin was amazing. How he views everything and his process, I did not expect that. I knew who he was, I didn’t know him though. Watching him talk and go off, I found that interesting.
That was a borderline stressful episode for me, Rick Rubin & Stephen Mitchell, because I was like, “It’s either going to work or it’s not.” I saw it in my mind for so long but I didn’t know if we were going to be able to do it. Stephen was as gracious as he could be and Laird muscled Rick to be here pretty much. I thought, “I’m in over my head. They’re going to talk about things. I’m out of my depth but I’ll let them talk.” I thought that would be interesting.
It was. I thought that worked brilliantly.
That one was good. A takeaway, weirdly, from a superficial point of view, I will say Benjamin Bikman. He was reminding us about insulin sensitivity over glucose monitoring and understanding that the insulin system still is not a direct correlation. That reminder about why it’s so important to stay insulin-sensitive, Bikman did a good job of driving that home.
Weirdly we’re talking about quercetin earlier, a small reminder of having something as part of your daily ritual that’s good for you was good. Another episode that I appreciated was the Simon Hill one. What it did for me was it encapsulated what I’m hoping to do, which is to allow a conversation between people with different points of view.
I don’t eat vegan or vegetarian, he does, and his allowance for, “If you do, fine.” If you ask me one of the goals of the show, why is everyone complaining or trying to get everyone else to do it the way they do it? It’s about the idea of doing it the best way that you can and the way that is right for you in your physiology and ultimately sticking to real food. Simon was good that way.
That was a big overall take for me for this whole series. It’s just that there’s no right way. You have to figure it out yourself for you. It could be a combination of things. If you have problems, it could be the food, and it could be the x-rays. That was probably the biggest thing that I’ve taken and I’ve repeated it to so many people and friends, like, “You can figure out all your problems, you just have to figure out what works for you.” That’s a huge thing for me.
I was going to say Ben Bikman. I can echo that. An obvious choice seemingly would be Bert Kreischer because I love that forward facing and he’s a standup comedian. His whole image is having fun. He puts out content that makes you laugh. I love how you handled it and how the discussion went. He is structured, rigid, and punitive, and he parties hard but that only means he works harder.
He will stay up late and party and then get up early before he does anything and work out. Stuff like that is inspiring for me to hear. He’s more on the celebrity end than the scientist end. Seeing there’s a structure in that and it’s not always the front-facing and making you laugh, “I’m living the best life ever.” There are daily challenges to go through and there are steps to take. You were able to have fun and be funny.
To your point, I always tell my girls, “Whatever you want to do, it’s all going to take work so better love it.” I would imagine that standup comedians are some of the most disciplined people with writing, practicing, and rehearsing night after night, working on material, and working on jokes. The exciting part is that you can express that any way you want but you’re never going to get away from the work.
What I’m hearing is you want to get into standup now.
No. Nobody paid for that.
Is there anything you want for your show in 2023? Is there something you’re looking forward to? Is there an ideal guest? Is there an ideal structure? Is there something you want to get better at or something you want to ditch?
I’m going to do better at asking the question. I won’t try to set everyone up, make them feel good, and rub their feet before I ask the question, I’ll just ask it. That does remind me that ultimately, I would still like to bring more of my real personality. It’s like a weird thing where I’m not trying to pull a wool over anyone’s eyes.
For people who know me, it sounds like me for the most part. If you know me, this is me. It might be the more high-polished me. It’s to do that more succinctly, more directly, and to try hard. I have some guests that I would like. My hope is to be able to ask the questions I want. Maybe I feel polite in a way. Like Huberman, I wanted Huberman for the new year but he was busy. Ultimately, I want information from Huberman, real takeaways on health.
What I want to know is, how are you handling getting attention now? I know that’s a real thing. For me, it’s always making sure that if you hear this show and if you heard that person interviewed twenty other times, at least we had the ability to do it a little bit differently. That’s all. My hope is to continue to do that. It’s like, who’s the human behind the information? Laird always tells me, “Don’t kill the messenger.” There’s something to be said for knowing a little bit about someone, especially if you’re trying to follow their advice.
I agree with that.
Not everyone who’s ever done that before has ever given their personal side to what they’re presenting, especially in the health and science fields. It’s like, “Here are the facts.” It’s like, “But who are you?” It resonates with that joke that you want your doctor to do everything naked so you can see that it’s working for him.
I want to impose enough on people politely but still impose on them to say, “You got to cough it up too. We’re all out.” That ultimately can inspire someone more in the long run than the information. Also, it’s trying to figure out, how they are doing it in their life. What is holding them back or what is the struggle? It’s that soup that we’re all in. If you ask me what I want to do, I want to do that more concisely and thoroughly in my show, and I want to take more real estate. I loved volleyball and I played for fun as well but of course, you want to win. If winning in this game is getting more real estate, that’s what I want to do.
Let’s do it. I have a couple of random questions that I want to ask you.
Here we go.
Can I start with the rapid-fire?
The seed oils?
Yes, all the seed oils.
The Hateful 8, Cate Shanahan. What about it?
I had never even thought about it until you started talking about it and now it’s talked about on the show and bringing it up on the show. Now I’m starting to think about it. I go to the grocery store and I look at the ingredients and I say, “It’s the first two ingredients, canola oil, safflower oil, seed oil, or sunflower oil.”
My girlfriend and I make popcorn at least 3 or 4 nights a week over the stove and we used to use canola oil, and I said, “We need to switch to coconut oil.” She was like, “It’s not going to taste as good.” I was like, “It’s going to taste all right.” It tastes awesome and delicious and we love it. Now we use coconut oil. Seed oils are bad oils.
It’s a harder process to get the oil from. It’s not as easy for your body to manage because it’s more processed. It took more processes to make it an oil where avocado, coconut, and olive come from the meat of the item.
It tastes better. Is that why It’s in every product?
It’s cheap and it’s usually a byproduct of something else. If they had something else laying around, it was like, “Now we have this oil that we can use and it’s cheap.” Some of it probably does taste better. It’s tough on you. It’s tough on inflammation and metabolic function. It gets in the way. If it’s an everyday thing that you’re eating, it’s tough.
Nut oils are good.
What do you have? Walnut oil, pumpkin seed oil, and grape seed oil. Grape seed oil might be good for your skin. I don’t think you should eat it. It’s the stuff from the meat, olives, coconut flesh, and avocado. There could be some debate around red palm oil from red palm meat from the flesh and not from the seed. I have a tendency to stay away from that because the education on that is a little deeper. It’s keeping it simple.
Everything else should start to be on a list of avoiding. Saphire, sunflower, grape seed, canola, and cotton seed. If you’re at the grocery store and you look at every single bag and every single dressing, it’s 1 of the first 3. It’s like, “I need to completely prioritize and reorganize.”
The flip side of that is if you cook a lot at home and you’re eating the good stuff at home and you do the thing and you go out, it’s okay. By the way, when we go to a restaurant, you’re eating that stuff. It doesn’t matter.
You can’t get out of that.
Erewhon doesn’t prepare any of its cooked foods with any of the other oils. Who goes Erewhon? That’s the other side of it, don’t worry about it. Don’t get all psycho and neurotic because that stress is worse than whatever you were going to consume. When you can control it, do it so don’t buy it and bring it home. When you go to the restaurant, understand what’s happening, that’s all. Don’t kid yourself.
Remind me again, it’s bad for your microbiome.
It wreaks havoc on your system and your metabolic function because it creates inflammation.
Also, the gut, which then translates to everywhere.
It starts there and does other things as well. I have friends who talk about transmuting things like praying above your water where you go, “This isn’t going to hurt me.” There’s something to be said about that. Not every day, three meals a day, like, “This chili dog…” I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about sometimes when we’re out, it’s being like, “I feel blessed that I have food. I’m going to eat the food and hope it blesses my body.”
There’s another element sometimes when we’re looking at health and bringing an attitude of, “I understand what this is and I’m grateful for what it is. Maybe I can get the best thing out of it.” It’s like when people say a blessing, “Thanks for the food.” Holy water gets blessed and there is the science that talks about people taking a bit of it from one container and putting it into another water and it positively impacts the other water. Vibration, feeling, emotion, and all these things, and now we’re a little woo-woo, but it’s real.
It’s like entering into the world with the right intention and thinking that what you’re doing has the right intention for you. You’re probably going to come away with something better but you have to pay attention, that’s the thing. Laird wants to make sure. No one’s paying attention, it’s all the little things, even for a moment. We’re all just ripping through life. We need to pay attention. Even though we have to move quickly, how do we slow our minds down enough to pay attention to be like, “I’m going to drink this water.”
That’s interesting because when you become present and start to pay attention, your mind starts to probably go faster because now you’re quieting everything else. Like meditating, when you first sit down and meditate, you’re quieting everything but that’s when everything starts to get loud because you’re starting to notice everything.
It’s also the forces that be, it’s coming to get you. You try to be healthy. The forces that be, they’re coming for you. It’s the way it is. I always joke with my male guy friends, they’re like, “If you want to meet a girl, say you’re celibate, ‘I’m waiting for someone special.’” I go, “Forget it.” It is the way life is, “I’m trying not to eat this or that.” The other force in the world is coming for you. It’s also about saying that this is a natural tension. It goes back to the tension. If we sit on a fence, we’re good because nothing’s going either way.
The more we’re going to try to do one thing, the more something else will happen, and that’s where the education is, those are the lessons. It’s like, “I see now. I’m trying to be quiet. I’m trying to do this or that. Now, this other energy is coming for me. No problem.” It fits. It’s supposed to be that way. Everyone freaks out. It’s like when you’re sitting in bed and you’re not getting your sleep and you’re like, “I’m not going to sleep and then I’m not going to recover. I’m going to get up tomorrow and I’m going to be tired.” Chill out, it’s all going to happen.
I hate that when I have a 5:00 AM departure for a flight and then the whole night you’re like, “Is it time?” That’s life.
Speaking of nighttime and sleep, I’m curious about what your sleep routine or habits were in your late 20s and early 30s. Is this similar to your sleep routine now? Did you have it locked back then and it’s stayed consistent or has it changed? When did you lock in your sleep routine? I’m finding that my sleep is something I need to focus on.
You do music at night and you sleep late and you drink alcohol, which is disruptive to your sleep. For you, if your lifestyle is that, how within that can you do your best? That means the alcohol. If you’re going to stay up late and be up, then you accept that but you don’t have to drink alcohol. Maybe you save it special for a certain place or celebratory show or something. How do you have something else if you’re willing? Otherwise, don’t even start the conversation.
I’ve already wanted to cut out a ton of the alcohol. It’s not that I drink a lot but enough for it to affect me, for sure.
Do you remember Frank Zummo saying, “It was two drinks a night. It was five shows a week.” It’s 10 and then it’s 40 a month or whatever. Control what you can. If your band’s playing at night, that’s when you’re playing. What are you going to do? The alcohol and try not to eat.
That’s a big one for me too. I get so hungry at night. It’s so hard to say no.
Those are the things. If you are going to eat, what are you going to eat? That’s not going to serve you, typically. In my 20s, I was tired a lot. I was training all the time. I went to bed pretty early, not as early as I do now. I probably went to bed more like 10:30 or 11:00. Laird has always gone to bed early because surfers get up obnoxiously early like they’re in the dark.
I’ve lived with Laird since I was in my mid-20s. I’ve had that force next to me for that long, “Going to bed? When are you going to bed? I’m going to go to bed. I’m going up to my pillow.” He even has a whole thing, “I’m going up.” It’s like an announcement. Everyone goes, “You’re going up? Everyone’s going up?” I’ve never been a good sleeper. I’m still not a good sleeper. I do all my worrying, all my organizing, and all my list-making at night.
I relate to that.
I still deal with that. If I have a kid out, I won’t be asleep until the kid gets home. Believe me, their curfew is not 9:30, I’ve tried. This is it, we try. We’re never going to get it perfect even when we know. I’m not in a band. I’m doing the best I can. All the other things I’m doing are supporting me. I still don’t have it right. I had it pretty locked in.
The alcohol is tough on you. Nobody loves to hear that one. Everyone’s like, “Boo.” Also, caffeine past 2:00 PM is not great for people. It starts an uptick in a disruption to sleep. I do have this thing called pro-endorphin that I take occasionally, which is a niacin formula. It’s by Nutraceutics. If you look up pro-endorphin, you’ll find the company. It’s a little packet that gives me a 90-minute boost. You put it in water but it won’t mess up my sleep. I love it.
It’s not caffeine, it’s something else.
It’s nice and it gives you a blood push and you’re like, “Let’s go.” Let’s say I didn’t get to train or I’ve got to do something and it’s 5:00, I’m not going to have caffeine, and I’m not going to have coffee. I’ll be dead. I’ll be up cleaning closets or something. That’s a good one.
I’ll check that out because I’m notorious for drinking coffee till 5:00 PM or 6:00 PM.
Try it, pro endorphin.
I will, for sure.
It’s by Nutraceutics. You can get it online. It’s badass. They come in little packets you put in your water. Maybe you need two so you have one and then you back down and maybe get another. It’s a good one.
5:00 PM, anytime.
Yeah. It’s like, “I do it and hit the hay.”
Does it feel like a pre-workout or is it similar to that?
You feel alert and awake and energized.
[bctt tweet=”As long as you can afford to lose whatever it is that you’re investing in, perfect.”]
Do you have any other rapid fires?
Yeah. I honestly wanted to sit on this sleep habits conversation for a second because it resonated with me. I have a partner and we sleep together. This 2022, I was a 5:00 AM person. I started a job that made me wake up at 5:00 so that made me start going to bed at 9:00 or 10:00. Life didn’t change other than my life changing and affecting hers. She had social engagements till 11:00 PM or midnight. She works in production in LA. Her work doesn’t start till 10:00. Pre my 5:00 AM, we were on the same sleep schedule. 5:00 AM starts for me, there’s no other choice. You have to be in bed by 9:00 if you want to stay healthy in the long term.
Frequently, our relationship was strained because that would make our whole schedules clash where she would’ve to stay out and I wouldn’t like that. I would be up no matter if I was in bed or if I was tired. She shifted her schedule. She was getting up at 6:00 or 7:00 at times so she’d be in bed by 10:00. I don’t know if you can speak about how your sleep relationship together has shaped and formed highs and low moments.
I’ve submitted. Also, who’s more right in this way? What Laird is saying is, “Let’s get to bed.” In the end game, he’s more right. It’s a supportive message for the greater good, for me as an individual, for the household, and for us as a couple. Yield to it. I don’t need to stand on it because I like to stay up and watch something else. It’s like, “He’s right, go to bed.” It’s a conversation and a compromise.
Here’s the thing, the person who’s going to shift is the one who’s got to do it. It can’t be asked. If he’s asking me to go to bed, I’m like, “Don’t ask.” Nobody wants to be told what to do. You put all this stress and tension around it, that’s what you can’t do. It’s like, “I’ll see you.” What happens is when we don’t make the demand and you had no choice, the other person is like, “I love them. I want to be around them more even time for sex, energy, and all this stuff.”
Part of the deal is they’ll make the change. If they don’t, then they’re not your partner. We can ask that. I’m like, “You’re not my dad. I don’t need a bedtime.” You can’t do that. If you’re on the side of like, “This is reasonable, people.” The other person will shift. It’s never as quickly as we want and they may not even be like, “I see what you’re saying.” It does happen.
You’ve talked about it, you’ve started to go to bed earlier is one thing you did this 2022. By the nature of the routine, is that something that was a conscious choice?
It started happening more naturally and I started to be conscious at the beginning, like, “He’s right. Why am I staying up?” What happens is your body then gets accustomed to going to bed around the same time. I started going to bed earlier. At first, I was a little bit begrudging, like, “This is stupid. Why am I going to bed?” You’re then like, “I feel better.”
Especially for a person who doesn’t sleep great, that gave me a little more time to try to get those hours. I go to sleep, I just don’t stay asleep. If I was going to bed now at 9:00, if I was waking up at 2:00, at least I got a solid five hours versus 11:00 and 2:00. It’s a little bit of that too. Your body gets used to it. I wonder what we think we’re missing when we stay up. It’s a time in life.
Habits have to do with it too. For me, it’s not anything I’m missing, I just can’t set the phone down or when I do, I find something else to pick up before I can finally sit down and go to sleep.
Being with ourselves and being quiet, there is nothing harder. I don’t need to get up in there, up in my brain, like, “Let’s get some distraction.” It’s the hardest thing for all of us. There’s something beautiful when you have a relationship with that, with not having the impulse to grab something or be distracted or see something. There’s something beautiful with the stillness. You can not only look forward to it but observe yourself within it, your thoughts, and your feelings. That’s when we get down into what’s going on with us and that’s why we’re looking for a distraction. Who wants to know that? That’s scary sometimes.
More often than not, at the end of that process, I like the process. I enjoy self-reflection. I’m accustomed to addictions, distractions, pings, and lights.
Who isn’t? The thing is when it’s happening, you go, “I see it.” Not be like, “What the hell?” It’s just, “Of course, that’s happening. Today I’m going to make a different choice.” That’s why it’s that grace because when we add more resistance, now you’re in that. It’s a colossal waste of time. Instead of like, “Of course, that thing is fun and there’s a lot on there and there’s stuff to see and I’m going to make a different choice.”
Right before bed is when it all comes to your head pretty much.
Most of the goal-setting for the day is done. You’re by yourself.
Do it outside the room. If you have a place where you sit at a desk or something, make yourself do it there because then you go, “That is for that. When I go to bed, my bed is for reading a book or going to sleep.”
That is a great goal to have because I can see the benefits. I already know how hard and difficult that’ll be for me because I’m accustomed to the phone in bed. It’s the discipline. You said one of your goals was no phone in the bed at all whatsoever. When you said that, I was like, “I can’t even imagine a world like that.”
It’s the trade-off. You have to see the value of trading off for that. It’s like when we were talking about with your parents, “What am I going to do instead of? I need something else. Also, I have to buy into why that’s good.” Usually, if you feel more rested and then all of a sudden you have more energy to train and all of a sudden you look in the mirror, you think, “I’m looking pretty good.” There you go. You need that time.
I need to get to that side.
Setting up your future self for success is what I think about. It’s like gamifying how I can look out for future Cam. If I want to make sure I’m going to drink water, I fill up a glass of water or a bottle of water and put it by my bed or in the bathroom or somewhere I know I’m going to be so I go and consciously drink that.
If I want to get sunlight in the morning, I put my clothes outside before in a bag or my shoes outside so I make sure I go outside to get that. It’s weird but whatever it takes. It’s like atomic habits, it’s setting the things for your future self, and it works in reverse. If you don’t want to eat pop-tarts, don’t buy pop-tarts. Walk by the pop tarts but don’t buy them because then they’re going to be in your house and then you’re going to eat them.
Also, I don’t want to pay that price.
Put them in a freezer so you don’t want to eat them because they’re frozen.
You don’t want to pay that price.
The battle is with present Tristen. Future Tristen needs to beat present Tristen.
Think about future Tristen.
Think about your parents.
That’s weird. That’s where it’s boom. That’s what does it.
We all have the chance. We talk about epigenetics and stuff on this show all the time. Pull the levers, pull your own levers. If I took what my parents gave me, I’ll have a different life. How much are you excited and interested in that life that you’re building? What levers do you want to pull? Again, it goes back to the work. It’s the way it is. Once we get grown up about, like, “It sucks,” then it’s easy. It’s like training, it’s hard.
I don’t go to the gym thinking, “This is going to be super fun today.” It’s like, “It’s going to be hard.” We know that. That’s also part of being an adult. Part of being an adult is like, “I don’t want to but I see the real long-term value so I will.” Also, being a grownup. You could have a 16-year-old that’s acting like a grownup. I’m not putting a number on it. It’s that clear relationship with like, “What I want is so much more interesting, dynamic, and good for me.”
It’s this instant gratification.
Tell me what else.
This is something I’ve been curious about you personally. I’m curious about your take on investing if you have investments, financial investing, project investing, or people investing. You can say, “Screw this topic.” I haven’t heard you speak about it a lot. I’m curious.
I’m not a big fan, for obvious reasons, about being beholden to the market. I’ve had friends and I watch them read the paper and see the market and then their whole day is shot. Investing in people or ideas that you believe in being an entrepreneur. As I go, what I would say is as long as you can afford to lose whatever it is that you’re investing in, perfect. Investing in things only to make money, I understand that in theory. If it’s not something you believe in, I would have a hard time with that. However, that’s probably why I’m not a billionaire.
In most cases, to be highly successful, you have to be about the numbers. Personally, it would be something I’d have to either use, believe in, or the person. I’d have to be willing to never see that money again. If you’re starting a new business, what I would say is even though it’s stressful, it’s better in the long run probably not to use your own money. Now, you will answer to people. If you fail, you will let down other people and that one sucks too. I like it.
I’m into earning, that’s my whole mindset. We own a lot of Laird Superfood and stuff but I’m still of the earning mentality, “How do I earn?” Once you do that, you’re free because you’re not waiting for something to happen or going to sell this. It’s like, “I’m earning.” When other bigger things happen or occur, that’s a bonus. It can’t be reliant upon because that energy I don’t think breeds success. It doesn’t mean you’re not all in because that’s different. You have to be all in for everything to be successful.
If it’s your business, you better be all in. Especially if you’re looking for investors, the other part of that is that reek of desperation. It’s a fine line of like, “I’m all in but I will find a way.” It’s like asking someone out, it never smells good even if you’re exactly right. You have the best idea, it’s the right time in the market and all these things. If it reeks of that, you’ll get leveraged. It doesn’t work. It’s like a mix. I’m an earner. I’m into building and working and not like, “I hope that thing goes off.”
That can stem to being a businesswoman from starting companies to where you are now. Was it something you sought out or did you think about, “I want to own a business.” How have you grown into functioning as a businesswoman with other people involved and with investors going public?
Try dealing with the board, it’s fun. I don’t want to say I fell into it but let’s say in my 20s when I was being an athlete, you realized quickly, “There’s a real timeline on this, a finite period of time you’re going to do this. What am I going to do that I own that it doesn’t matter what I look like?” There’s always that. Also, if I can jump.
It’s like putting it out into the universe, “I need something else.” I’m interested in things so then the opportunities show up. It was maybe knowing before it was going to be businesses, knowing, “I’m going to need other things to feel not productive but to feel like I’m not at the mercy of a company’s whim.” That did show up as businesses, some failed and some succeeded.
You then realize, “I will need people who do this specifically.” For example, the person who co-founded Laird Superfood with us is a real entrepreneur. Once the company went public, we have a new CEO because that’s what he does and you want that skillset. It is a skillset that, in my lifetime, I would not get.
The other thing is also knowing where’s your lane. It’s tricky when it’s a business of your own that also has someone on the packaging that you love, that you say, “They represent this.” It’s knowing how to keep that in there and letting people do what they need to do so that they can be successful. Also knowing that people come and go. The group that started when you were a small company, none of those original people are there. All of that is hard and an interesting lesson.
It’s not thinking you know more than you know. Doing grownup business, there are a lot of moving parts and I don’t want to know that stuff. I want to be also creating and doing other things that then inadvertently bring real value to the businesses I’m doing the way that I can. All of a sudden, I’m not interested in being a CFO or a CEO because you can have it, it’s brutal.
Are there tidbits you would teach or tell someone starting their business?
Get mentors. Ask people, they will tell you everything. You don’t have to take everyone’s advice but hear it. If the same thing keeps showing up 3 or 4 times, like, “Don’t do this or try this,” pay attention to that because it might save you a lot of time because people know. I even laugh at our older friends, we’re like, “We’re going public.” Half of them rolled their eyes because they know how hard it is. Based on a CPG product versus a tech company, they know the difference between being public versus being private and all that stuff.
Get a mentor in the field that you’re interested in. Be willing also to work for people in that way, shadow them, and do stuff for free. If there’s a company that you love or you see something done, reach out, and call them. You’d be surprised who you can reach out to and connect with. People are willing to help you and it might be easy for them because they have so much experience compared to you.
Try not to do it blindly and then simultaneously keep listening to your instinct and your vision because it’s your project. Business, as it grows, is brutal. The fantasy of smaller business is so much more fun and whimsical and like, “We’re in these markets and we do this.” When you start getting into a bigger business, it’s pretty brutal.
That ties to something I wanted to ask. At least for Tristen and me, our business has, for the better, gotten busy and taken off. We’ve worked on a lot of things but that came with a sacrifice. It’s at an individual level. We don’t have investors. Lifestyle choices get harder. Working out gets harder. Relationships get harder. Is that something you can speak to?
You’re in that window, that’s what it is. For me to BS and be like, “You got to find time to train.” It’s unrealistic. What you have to realize is where are your leaks because we all have time leaks. Where are they? Minimize those and in lieu of those, see if you can put a habit in there that will support you for the long run because you do have time leaks. I don’t give a crap what anyone tells me. I’m busy. I could follow you for a day and I could get you an extra 30 minutes.
How much does it mean to you? I wouldn’t sacrifice my whole life for growth but that level of dedication on some level is what it takes. Whatever partner you’re going to be with is going to also understand that or they’re not and they’re not going to be around. You being tough on yourself about, “My enjoyment time would be my exercise time.” It’s that way.
When you say we’re in the window, what do you mean by that?
You’re young men, that’s what you’re doing right now, you’re building for future selves. That’s what it takes. It’s a dog fire.
That’s refreshing to hear too because that’s what we’re trying to do. To hear that, that’s the process.
It’s what it is.
I can see that window. Neither of us has kids, a mortgage, investors, or real stuff we’re beholden to other than the creative deadlines or the production.
It’s exactly right.
I could foresee it.
That’s the thing, you have these seasons of life and to know, “It’s time to put our foot on the gas.” Don’t let the wheels come off the bus, that’s the thing. How do you keep it on the road? It doesn’t mean like, “I’m going to be in the best shape of my life and start a new business.” It’s probably not going to happen.
[bctt tweet=”This is the thing, all of these doctors and scientists, everybody is saying the same five things from different points of expertise.”]
However, button up. It’s like, “Get rid of that.” That’s what makes the difference between people who pull it and don’t, you see them. People are dead serious on the line. Everything has to feed into that. Even your partner has to be like, “I get it. I know what you’re doing. I honor that.” That’s what you do. If people can’t, you’ll be like, “You got to go.”
That’s a ruthless process on its own too.
When you find the right person, it’s easy, that’s the thing. You find the right person that’s like, “I see you and I appreciate that you have a dream and you’re trying to make it happen.” That’s your person. I heard that investing too. There was a woman on my show who was like, “You go and you pitch and you pitch and you pitch.” That’s not your group because then you’ll pitch to someone and they go, “I see that idea. I get it.” It’s belief in that.
That’s a good way to put it.
The show is considered a health and wellness show. What are your thoughts on that health and wellness space, the industry?
I don’t even feel like I’m part of health and wellness because it’s like, “Eat this or do that and move like this and it’ll all work out.” It doesn’t work out. That’s a little bit of a short message or an incomplete message. I get it and it’s easy. It’s like, “Check me out. Look at my abs.” It’s perfect, I get it. How am I going to get you to do this for 40 or 50 years? How am I going to encourage you to have that attitude bleed into all areas of your life? It’s not like, “Drink this.” That’s a hard message to sell.
I feel like sometimes health and fitness is an unfair thing that we’re selling to people because they think, “If I do those couple of things, it’ll all be dialed in,” and it’s not. It’s ongoing, years and years. That’s what I’m interested in, how do we get you into the frame of mind where you’re like, “This is a part of my life, all of this.”
It’s not like, “I have this big shake and some dumbbells.” I don’t want to say it’s shallow but how much time do brands have to educate people or connect with them? I get it but unfortunately, we’re talking about their wellness. I feel a part of it, it’s interesting for me. People almost view Laird and I like we’re meatheads a little bit and I’m like, “It’s funny.”
That’s ironic because, arguably, you’re the ones that put most of it into practice on a daily basis. You’re not technically selling something every day. You are an example by working out.
Someone was on Tim Ferris and he was talking about authenticity as terrible words about consistency. It is easier because we’re together. We’ve got a built-in system. If we were separated, we would still live the way we live. I don’t want to sell you anything. I want to have a conversation. I want to share what I’ve seen or discovered or what works for me.
If I can be one of many things that impact you to move in that direction, perfect. It’s not that I have it figured out, I don’t. I don’t have anything figured out but I have it more figured out. It’s not about me. It is interesting when people think, “You guys are into sports.” It’s like, “Yeah, sure.” You only can do that for so many hours a day. There’s a lot of life and I want to live it. Laird wants to play and be on waves and be with his family. Nothing else makes sense to him. I use him as a tether to keep it simple.
There are a lot of details, laundry, bills, flights, insurance, relationships, and trying to maintain friendships, family, kids, your personal life, your sex life, and aging, and you look in the mirror. There’s a lot. I spend a lot more time on that stuff than I do working out. Health and wellness can be a good starting point. Let’s say someone’s behind and they need to start, great. I want to go to the next tier, which is someone has decided it’s important. Now let’s go, that’s what I’m going to do.
Giving them a frame of mind so they’re thinking about it when they wake up and throughout the day, “What am I eating here?”
It’s not a separate part of their life like going to the movies. It is a part. One of the things I do is try to eat a certain way and I seem to move my body every week. It’s not like, “If I get time…” Are we not past that yet? It’s inevitable. If people can’t get there, I don’t look at it as bad. It’s like, “How do we figure out how to get them to decide?” By the way, this could annoy a lot of people because they might go, “I don’t want to decide.” I’m not going to get into any of that.
What do they say? Have you ever seen a large 90-year-old person? Probably not. I was listening to Rogan and they were like, “Have you ever seen an obese 90-year-old person?” We’re all here together like brothers and sisters. How do we elevate? This is one of the ways that I feel like I can be like, “I can talk about this stuff or I’m interested in it enough to talk about it.” I’m not here to tell anyone what to do. I don’t care. I don’t even want to tell my kids what to do. I’m not interested. I can barely control myself.
Let’s not BS. Let’s not act like it’s not important because it is. It makes it easier. I’ve said this a lot, it is the armor to manage all the people have to manage. I have it easy. There are people who have to deal with so many things. How do we support them? How do we armor them up to go? When I drive my car in PCH and I see a lady who’s finished a full day of work sitting at a bus stop, it’s like, “I have it easy.” I’m clear about it.
I did an interview and the lady’s like, “You’re strong.” I go, “My whole life was set up for that since I was 17 years old, lift weights, compete, and try to eat a certain way. My whole life has been set up since I was a young adult to be strong.” How do we get the information to the people that they’re not getting that support? That’s interesting to me. That’s health and wellness. It’s not like, “You’re an athlete. You’re so strong.” That’s great. Have you met my nine trainers? Give me a break. It’s funny to me. I’ve gone past this circle of that and being distracted by what that is but that’s why I think it’s important.
That’s great. Do you have any others? I have a last potential section.
Back to the investing thing. What’s your take on crypto if you have one?
I don’t. I’m scared of crypto.
We were going to do NFTs and everything for Laird and I was working with a friend of mine. There’s a whole other thing but I have a friend who has a Boonji and then everything went down. What I said is I’m going to move into that space because now that it’s down, I want it to be like it’s not a money grab. If you’re saying to me this is going to exist and people are going to connect here, then I want to go there and I want to figure out ways I can reward you for being healthier by using Laird Superfood, by using Laird Apparel, by using XPT, and by using all these brands we have that we can create a “club.” What can I give you? This 2023, I am going to be doing that. It’s a bit of a shift from 2022 but it’s like, “I’m going to do that.” Wherever we can connect with people, I want to try. Because I’m old, it doesn’t mean I don’t want to try there. Also, when they talk about utilities and all that, I have stuff to give you. I’ve taught more. We do gatherings. We’re ready to go. I want to figure that out, for real. If they do it with crypto, fine but I’m scared of crypto.
I’m kidding. You know what I mean. I’m not that smart. It’s not intuitive to me so I’m not even going to pretend. I need a 16-year-old to be like, “This is what’s happening.” I’ll be like, “Perfect,” or you guys.
It’s him for me. I’m not either.
Do you know what I mean? I see it and I go, “Haha.” I’m not even going to pretend to be like, “Da, da, da.” Shut up, Gab. That’s what I’m interested in doing. If they’re talking about Web 2.0 or whatever, that’s where people are going to go. It is interesting. How am I going to get you to go online to move? It’s new languages. Fine, I’m open to learning the language because some parts of that language won’t be different. We still have to eat a certain way and move. How do I learn how to do that over there too? I’m willing. We have stuff to give. We can do it.
I’m excited to see what happens with that.
I can see Laird and he’ll be like, “What are we doing? What did you say to me?” We’re doing an experiment that wasn’t my idea. On this, I am the obliging puppet. We’re going to take highlights and tidbits and some of our favorite go-to’s, whether it’s in the pocket of nutrition, movement, mental health, self-empowerment, and being natural. Go outside, look at the sun, and move around without weights and dumbbells. All of the things that we’ve liked from different people that have come on the show, we’re going to present them in short and quick invitations for people to try and incorporate into their day and week.
Is Bert’s alcohol bringing us pixie dust in one of the experiments?
We should have done Bert’s to try something new, like, “Just do it. Don’t worry about sucking.” I thought that was important.
You’re going to be horrible for a while.
What do you think?
Let it suck.
One of my daughters was complaining about some weird and small thing and I go, “There are 8 billion people on the planet. Nobody cares. Let’s go. Just do it. Whatever it is, don’t worry about it.” That’s the other thing the internet has done, it’s made all of us live in a bubble and we think our bubble is so important and it’s not.
We’re all going to die.
That’s Tristen’s new nihilistic thing. Whenever there’s an issue, “It doesn’t matter anyway, we’re all going to die.”
Why Joe Rogan is successful besides that he started early for the sake of just doing it and he’s a smart person is there’s a part of him that’s just doing it to do it. That’s why he was so successful. It wasn’t like an angle and strategy. It’s like, “I’m going to do it. I’m going to do it the way it feels good.” He also is the right person. He is a man. He is a comedian. He has a fighting background so there’s this weird hodgepodge of weird edges. He has a family. He is bright and he’s goodhearted. When you peel it back, you’ve got somebody who’s goodhearted.
At the end of all these silly jokes behind that is somebody who’s like, “Let’s try.” When we talk about strategies for the year and this and that, I need to show up and try to keep doing a good job and see what happens. I have found in my life that when I start that way, I’m usually more successful. I do want to kick ass and take more real estate, which I do. Conversely, if I back it into, what can I do right now to be better at it? There are other people who can be strategic around it. That shouldn’t be me.
That’s what we’re here for.
Exactly. Let’s go and get strategic. I’m kidding but, in a way, it’s staying clear. What else?
Let’s do it.
Sometimes I worry that I’m getting too old, honestly. Guys like you won’t relate to me because I’m too old.
In what way? The relatability? Is that the fear?
I’m not looking for no or, “You look skinny in those jeans.” I’m saying it truthfully.
In every episode and every show that I’ve done here, it’s always like, “You’re going to go off and talk about extreme sports, performance, and all these stuff that I know I should be doing.” I do take away. There are usually little bits and pieces and I’m like, “For a non-sporty type, I do find it helpful.”
I am being honest. There are times when I’m like, “I might age out of this job.”
What do you mean by that? There’s the fear that the information you want to give people no longer holds value or it’s the way they’re interpreting the information or how you’re giving it because you’re too old.
Yeah. Too far into the journey to go back enough to make it relevant also to the group that’s coming up and old in my experience and appearance.
It all comes from the whole XPT thing. You guys have been doing that, for years, on your own. It wasn’t until Jenn’s like, “We should share this.” The show is like that too. You are on your own journey trying to better yourself and like, “I can share this.” It’ll always be relevant.
I’m being honest. It’s good.
It’s a good feeling. It probably checks you a lot too, for sure.
It’s also good to check to know so that it doesn’t control you. You got to let it go.
I agree with Justin, I don’t think it’s a fear that you should worry about. Every episode has a little nugget for everybody in a different way.
It’s a good motivator.
It’s funny that you’re thinking that you might be too old or you’re too far along but the things you’re talking about and the things you’re doing are so new and fresh and on the cutting edge. As long as you’re not giving a history lesson, you’re still on the cutting edge of what’s happening now. You might not be hot on what the next TikTok trend is but who gives a crap?
Also, they’re all lanes.
Thanks for having us.
Are you sure you got what you needed?
Yeah, there’s a lot here.
Thank you so much for reading this episode. Stay tuned for a bonus episode where I go deeper into one of the topics that resonated with me. If you have any questions for my guest or even myself, please send them to @GabbyReece on Instagram. If you feel inspired, please hit the follow button and leave a rating and a comment. It not only helps me, it helps the show grow and reach new readers.
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